00;00;02;21 - 00;00;19;01
Stasia Walmsley
Welcome to the Providence College podcast. I'm your guest host, Stasia Walmsley. Today, we'll talk to Andre Krupp, the director of plan giving here at PC, to get some insights into estate planning, what it is and how do you do it. Welcome to the Providence College podcast, Andrea.

00;00;19;02 - 00;00;22;17
Andrea Krupp
Thank you so much for having me. I'm thrilled to be here.

00;00;22;24 - 00;00;34;22
Stasia Walmsley
So I was hoping we could start today with the basics. I've heard terms like plan giving, gift planning, estate planning all kind of used interchangeably. And what does it all mean?

00;00;35;02 - 00;01;06;18
Andrea Krupp
That's a great question. So an individual has an estate. Every individual has an estate. If they own something, a property, cash, a car in their own name. So if you are married and you own things with your spouse, that's not an estate. That's a joint estate. But if you have a bank account that's in just your name and not in your spouse's name, that bank account is your asset, your personal estate.

00;01;07;01 - 00;01;34;06
Andrea Krupp
So estate planning or planned giving talks about how to distribute those assets that are in your estate, those assets that are in your own name. Now, married couples do that differently. There's a plan for a married couple, but it's essentially anything that is held in your name alone is your estate. So you could be 21 and have a car.

00;01;34;06 - 00;01;50;25
Andrea Krupp
You have an estate. If it's held in your name, you could be 121 and have multiple assets in your state. But essentially, the estate planning is the process by which you determine what's going to happen to those assets after your death.

00;01;51;07 - 00;02;19;25
Stasia Walmsley
And how is that different than something that I might do philanthropically on an annual basis or, you know, if something related to Providence College, something a gift I might give during giving Tuesday or a Friars give day. How how does working on some kind of a plan gift to Providence College differ from gifts that I might give that I'm not waiting for, you know, after I pass.

00;02;20;13 - 00;02;46;09
Andrea Krupp
When you give cash or and that's typically what happens on you know giving Tuesday or friars give is you're giving a cash gift and that comes right out of your pocket today. And so tomorrow you don't have that $100,000, whatever you've given. When you talk about using your assets from an estate and planning how to give those. The distribution doesn't come until after your death.

00;02;46;21 - 00;03;12;03
Andrea Krupp
So for most cases, let's say you use your insurance policy and you have one that you're not going to need for a spouse or a child. And you decided that the beneficiary can be Providence College. And that's a great gift. Well, that gift doesn't transfer until you die. So during your lifetime, you can change the beneficiary if something happens and you think, oh, wait a minute, I have another grandchild who needs it more.

00;03;12;14 - 00;03;43;22
Andrea Krupp
You can change that. That distribution during your lifetime and again during your lifetime. Your lifestyle isn't changed or impacted because the gift is deferred until after your death. So that's the difference. During giving Tuesday, during an annual giving day, during just a general gift to Providence College, during the year of any kind that is current. That's interesting. These are we're talking about more deferred gifts after your death.

00;03;44;15 - 00;04;20;02
Stasia Walmsley
Sure. So for somebody like me, say, who doesn't have Apple stock or is doesn't have, you know, multiple homes and things. What what what can really what can I do? What can we get out of an estate gift from me who doesn't assumed to have the type of wealth where I would would naturally think of estate giving? Are there options for for people who don't necessarily think they have the the the type of wealth that typically would lead them to think about giving a gift?

00;04;20;17 - 00;04;52;07
Andrea Krupp
Absolutely. Well, to back up a minute, estate planning is is planning for those distribution of assets and it's really about directing those the money and the assets that you've earned you've worked for throughout your life, telling the state and your family where those assets will go if you die without a plan, then the state takes over and they distribute the assets according to the Rhode Island statute.

00;04;53;05 - 00;05;32;19
Andrea Krupp
You as a young individual have you may not have multiple houses, but you do own probably a retirement asset. You have an IRA or a401k, you might have some life insurance, you might have the deed to a home, something like that. And you can change those beneficiaries of retirement assets. You might say, I, I know that for a one case and IRAs are the highest taxed assets when they are distributed to an individual.

00;05;32;19 - 00;06;13;13
Andrea Krupp
So the giving your IRA to your child, that child could be taxed up to 70% on that IRA because they are not a charity, they're an individual, and they're going to have to pay those taxes that you didn't pay on that deferred income using that asset as a charitable gift and giving that asset to, say, Providence College, which is a non taxable event, you can reserve cash to give it to your children and so you might end up giving more cash to your children and that's not going to be taxable versus giving, you know, if you give this other asset to Providence College.

00;06;13;13 - 00;06;51;22
Andrea Krupp
So this is a conversation that includes estate planning, attorneys, an accountant or a financial advisor to take a look at your whole picture. What are the assets that you own that you might not think are big or significant? However, the way that you give them, whether you give them to an individual or you give them to a charity, that process of deciding who gets what can really save you on the tax side and can save your children or your beneficiaries because you've chosen to give certain assets to a nonprofit.

00;06;52;11 - 00;07;09;19
Andrea Krupp
So again, I guess that was a very long way of saying you probably do have assets that you just don't realize things that you can very easily make Providence College the beneficiary of during your lifetime, realize absolutely no impact on your lifestyle.

00;07;10;16 - 00;07;41;23
Stasia Walmsley
You mentioned something interesting there, too, about thinking about what estate planning and plan giving. I imagine people think of their families primarily if they if they want to leave a legacy for their family. So, you know, children or grandchildren. And you just described something that I think is interesting about how this could actually, you know, working with an estate planning team that you could find ways to maybe make that more advantageous.

00;07;41;23 - 00;08;02;14
Stasia Walmsley
But I wonder if you could talk a little bit more about that, because it you know, if somebody is considering that they wanted to to make a difference in the lives of students at moving forward and make some kind of a philanthropic gift here, but feel like what will that take away from their legacy they're leaving for their children.

00;08;02;14 - 00;08;03;27
Stasia Walmsley
Is there a way to do both?

00;08;04;06 - 00;08;32;25
Andrea Krupp
Yep. That's the most common question and the most common statement I hear is I have grandchildren. I need to make sure that they have college funds or they have what they need. And the whole point of estate planning is to take a look at your whole picture. What do you have that you will want to pass on and who are those people and charities that you want to benefit?

00;08;33;17 - 00;09;07;02
Andrea Krupp
When you look at the big picture, you can with help. And I highly recommend, unless you are an expert yourself sitting down with an estate planning attorney and with or with a financial planner to look at what kinds of assets you have in your different buckets, right? Retirement assets, life insurance policies, cash stocks. Some of those assets, when transferred to individuals are highly taxable because they are realized capital gains.

00;09;07;05 - 00;09;49;23
Andrea Krupp
So you give a stock that's an appreciated stock to your son or daughter and they are going to have to pay the capital gains on that. Now, that's fine that that may not impact your decision at all, but you may have an asset in your portfolio that is less taxable. And so your accountant, your financial planner or your state planner may say, listen, if you transfer this asset to Providence College and retain this asset and give this one to your children, they will actually get more money in their pockets because they won't pay the kind of taxes that they would pay if you gave the you know, if you if you did it in reverse.

00;09;50;08 - 00;10;20;01
Andrea Krupp
So there are tax advantages. There are all sorts of ownership advantages to looking at your portfolio and making decisions about which ones could be given to to Providence College, for example. The other thing to consider is as charitable as you think it is and as loving as an action you think you might be making to give money to your grandchildren and your children.

00;10;21;02 - 00;10;58;18
Andrea Krupp
I encourage you to have the conversation with them because sometimes actually giving them assets can be a detriment to them. So for example, if someone's trying to apply to college and they're trying to get financial aid and you all of a sudden start transferring stocks to them, that changes their asset pool. Right. And so that sometimes people don't want the kinds of assets that you are giving to them and that your you know, sometimes they might not want to pay taxes on an IRA.

00;10;58;20 - 00;11;25;00
Andrea Krupp
They would rather do something else. These are conversations that need to have planned. Giving isn't just a one time thing. It's a living process while you're alive, having conversations with the people you love, having conversations with the charity you love, talking to Providence College and saying, Here's what I'm thinking about. Do you have any ideas? Does this make sense for the college?

00;11;25;10 - 00;11;53;26
Andrea Krupp
Here's the legacy I'm hoping to give it. That process can help everyone. And the goal for for me as an estate planning attorney and as the director here, my goal is always to make sure that your family is taken care of and that your gift is the way you want it to be for your family, for your your loved ones, for your friends, and for Providence College.

00;11;54;28 - 00;12;00;22
Andrea Krupp
So again, I guess this is all about relationships, conversation and and family.

00;12;01;14 - 00;12;26;14
Stasia Walmsley
So you make an interesting point there about kind of looping PC into your plans, but, you know, do you what if I just am creating and putting my will together? And I've talked to you and a state planning attorney, maybe not PC and I just I include PC in my will, but but PC doesn't necessarily know it until until I've already passed.

00;12;27;04 - 00;12;35;14
Stasia Walmsley
What are why would you why might you encourage people to participate in a conversation before that point? Is it necessary?

00;12;36;02 - 00;13;14;17
Andrea Krupp
It's not necessary, but highly, highly encouraged. And I'll tell you why. So we have received amazing gifts from individuals and there's one gift that we received from a gentleman that actually provides a full scholarship for a student who comes here. And the language of his trust was it was written in such a way that it was very difficult to actually achieve what he was trying to achieve, to give that scholarship to an individual.

00;13;16;05 - 00;13;48;20
Andrea Krupp
If that person had talked to us beforehand, we could have tweaked the language a little and made it much easier to administer and to accomplish the goal that he set out to accomplish. So alerting Providence College to a gift that you're intending to make allows us to do a few things. It allows us to work with you and make sure that the goal you have, the legacy you want to leave, is actually written in the right way so that it's seamless.

00;13;48;27 - 00;14;12;27
Andrea Krupp
We have a responsibility and an obligation, but also a strong desire to do what you want to do with that gift. And this just allows us to say, that's perfect. Or, Listen, here's the language that you should put into your request. This is this is perfect. This will work great. Or let's tweak it a little bit. What have you considered this?

00;14;12;27 - 00;14;39;27
Andrea Krupp
Let's let's look at it. The other thing it allows us to do is to say thank you. Remember, these gifts come after someone has died. If we don't know about them until then, we haven't had the opportunity to say thank you. Thank you for including Providence College in a plan that's typically reserved or traditionally reserved for family gifts, for gifts that you make to loved ones.

00;14;40;06 - 00;15;06;09
Andrea Krupp
Right. Think about the intimacy of creating an estate plan. You worked so hard to accomplish accomplish something to accumulate these assets. And you want to make sure your kids or your family is taken care of when you are willing to include Providence College. In that conversation, you are now including Providence College in an intimate family kind of gift.

00;15;06;09 - 00;15;29;04
Andrea Krupp
And that is something that I can't and don't ever underestimate and want to express my gratitude on behalf of Providence College for that generosity and kindness. So there are a couple of ways and reasons why I would love to know when people do these these kinds of things.

00;15;30;02 - 00;15;55;08
Stasia Walmsley
Andrea, I want to switch gears just a little to talk a little bit about you and how you got into this line of work. You mentioned that you are an attorney, and I am curious how your if you if you started in this kind of work directly as you started your your profession as an attorney or how you ended up at PC certainly.

00;15;55;08 - 00;15;57;23
Stasia Walmsley
But but in this line of work more generally too.

00;15;58;19 - 00;16;34;08
Andrea Krupp
So I'm laughing because my journey from law school to Providence College is very serpentine. It is not a straight line. I graduated from Roger Williams. I was in the second graduating class of the Roger Williams University Law School, and I have done everything from being a speechwriter for the Rhode Island Supreme Court Chief Justice Frank Williams to Litigation Family Court, Business Law, an estate planning law.

00;16;34;10 - 00;17;13;00
Andrea Krupp
I practiced just about everything. And then during the recession in 2009, I was offered an opportunity to become the director of the Catholic Foundation for the Diocese of Providence. And I. That was my first introduction to development work, Endowment Funds, Foundation Work. I loved it. I worked there for ten and a half years and then Providence College. This job came open and it called to me and I intentionally wanted to work in a Catholic institution and planned giving is my passion.

00;17;13;00 - 00;17;36;02
Andrea Krupp
I love the people that I meet and the stories that I hear. People have made some incredible gifts for incredible reasons, and I don't have to I don't have to worry about billable hours. I could talk to someone for as long as they will talk to me. And so that's how I got here. And I've been here for just about three years now.

00;17;36;10 - 00;18;07;14
Stasia Walmsley
And I wonder if you could describe what it's like having these type of conversations, because in many ways these are can be delicate conversations, sensitive conversations around end of life and and anticipating what will happen after after somebody dies and what what happens to their assets and and how that impacts their family. So what is it like having those type of conversations on a daily basis?

00;18;07;18 - 00;18;40;13
Andrea Krupp
So the word that comes to mind is humbling and I never take for granted the fact that someone's willing to share their story with me, whether it's a joyous one or one that has tragedy involved. I am so grateful that I can hear and share somebody's story. Estate planning is often we think about it as talking about death, right?

00;18;40;15 - 00;19;19;08
Andrea Krupp
Because that's when most of these gifts will transfer. But it's really talking about life and family. Providence College in my interview and throughout my time here, has always talked about being this the Friar family. And that's what planned giving is. And that's what plan giving at Providence College is. I talk to people about what they want to do to continue their legacy at Providence College to give back to Providence College, because these most of these people are so grateful for the time they had here.

00;19;19;08 - 00;20;02;03
Andrea Krupp
The friends they had here, they wouldn't be who they are without having their time at Providence College. That phrase comes up in almost every conversation. So talking to people about why they want to include the gift of Providence College and an estate plan is is it's humbling and and joyful. I have spoken with families who have lost children in the station nightclub fire while this child was here and then later lost another child, lost both their children.

00;20;02;03 - 00;20;32;05
Andrea Krupp
The one of the parents was a professor here during that time. Providence College rallied around this family and this family has left. I will leave a gift in their estate plan to Providence College. They've also already set up scholarships in their children's names at Providence College. And when you talk to them, you know, their grief is really it's tangible, right?

00;20;32;05 - 00;21;13;06
Andrea Krupp
Obviously, you can't I can't even imagine what that's like. But followed very closely on the heels of that grief is gratitude and family and and the sense of continuing to give life to students who they will never meet. Right. Because their scholarships are in doubt. And so generations after these parents are gone, students will still be coming here and they will know the names of their children.

00;21;13;06 - 00;21;48;04
Andrea Krupp
They will know the names of the family that's helping them so many levels that that's just profound and humbling. And so, you know, when when people want to create impact, leaving a gift in an estate plan that doesn't impact their current lifestyle is a way to for some people to give up the bigger gift. The gift they didn't think they could make because, you know, they might not have cash on hand now, but they do have assets that that will come later.

00;21;48;04 - 00;21;53;02
Andrea Krupp
So, yes, it was a long answer, but it is incredibly humbling.

00;21;53;09 - 00;22;21;19
Stasia Walmsley
No, it's it's it feels very joyous. Yeah. To have those conversations on an ongoing basis versus what might be assumed as being somewhat morbid or not at or you know, it sounds very much the antithesis to what somebody might think about in terms of talking about estate planning on a daily basis. But so I have a question. So how do you how do you even start?

00;22;22;12 - 00;22;36;10
Stasia Walmsley
Right. So for somebody who is really new to this, is inspired to want to think about making a plan gift to to Providence. What is that look like from a from, you know, first step?

00;22;36;23 - 00;23;03;29
Andrea Krupp
Yep. First step. Give me a call. I am available all the time. Happy to talk to anybody. There's no pressure. I, I don't draft estate plans. I talk about what are some options? What what do you want to accomplish? And if you have an attorney, I I'm happy to talk to that attorney so that whatever plans you're thinking of or you're thinking of, we can work together.

00;23;05;24 - 00;23;36;09
Andrea Krupp
So give me a call. Or if you want to, just do a little bit of looking around and and search out what is this estate planning stuff? Our website has a lot of really great, easy to read information. It's it's broken down by age so you can say okay here's you know I'm 67 years old what gifts might be appropriate for me or I have, you know, $500,000 in assets and it's broken down by asset amount as well.

00;23;36;09 - 00;24;06;18
Andrea Krupp
So you can take a look on either either side, you can approach it. Newsletters are on their stories about other donors that might resonate with you. There's no pressure about learning about estate planning for a plane gift to Providence College. 67% of Americans don't even have an estate plan. So they just start somewhere and a phone call is is really easy or you can shoot me an email.

00;24;06;24 - 00;24;20;14
Stasia Walmsley
So that's interesting. You were talking about how many people don't have a plan for their assets after death. Is that what are the what are the pitfalls in that?

00;24;21;03 - 00;24;51;20
Andrea Krupp
Well, so let's say you have a sister sister in law. A mother in law and a daughter, somebody that you absolutely do not want to have your assets. Right. If you don't make a plan and make a statement about who gets your assets, the state has a statute that talks about where those assets go. So there's an order who gets them first.

00;24;51;20 - 00;25;16;20
Andrea Krupp
And if that person's not alive and the next person gets them and there's an order now that person that you absolutely do not want to have those assets could be in that list. It's just you you left it up to the state to decide where your hard earned assets go because you haven't put a plan in order. The other piece is it's expensive.

00;25;17;24 - 00;25;42;25
Andrea Krupp
You'll be paying your estate will be losing between three and 8% of its value just because you have to the estate will have to pay for unnecessary legal fees, probate, things that you wouldn't have incurred, the estate wouldn't have incurred if you'd made a plan. Now, cost is one thing, but for me, I think the biggest part is you have work to do.

00;25;42;25 - 00;26;04;02
Andrea Krupp
You the assets you work to put money aside. You care about something or someone in your life. It's your decision, it's your money. And no one should have to tell you or no one should tell you where those things go. It should be your decision all the way up to the very last day of your life. And after.

00;26;04;02 - 00;26;11;14
Andrea Krupp
So, yeah, there are some pitfalls and you know, I. It's just not a good idea.

00;26;11;23 - 00;26;46;27
Stasia Walmsley
Yeah. Well, thank you so much for sharing all of that knowledge with us, because I do think there's a lot of information that you shared that people may may not know whether or not they're intending to make a gift to Providence College, just understanding how estate planning is so important at different ages. And is there anything that we didn't talk about today that you wanted to mention just so that people are better informed about about how to think about estate planning and gift planning?

00;26;47;27 - 00;27;29;02
Andrea Krupp
I think I just want to reiterate that gift planning for philanthropy to Providence College is really a product of gratitude and any of these gifts or conversations about gifts or conversations about thinking about gifts, you know, wherever you are in this journey, you will be treated with respect and and sincere gratitude for even having a conversation. And so I want to encourage people to take a look at what they have and what they want to do with their own asset and whether or not Providence is involved.

00;27;30;05 - 00;27;45;01
Andrea Krupp
Just make sure that you've done it the right way so that your loved ones are taken care of and you are the one to make the decision. And that's it, I think. I think it's all it's all about family and go.

00;27;45;01 - 00;27;48;12
Stasia Walmsley
Fryer's wonderful. Thank you so much, Andrea.

00;27;49;01 - 00;27;49;26
Andrea Krupp
Thanks, Data.

00;27;50;17 - 00;28;08;08
Stasia Walmsley
Thank you for tuning into the Providence College podcast. Episodes are available wherever you get your podcasts and on the college's YouTube channel or smart speakers. Thank you to our guest, Andrea Krupp and to PC podcast producer Chris Judge on Station Walmsley. Thanks for listening.